Thank you so much for writing this. Thank you for continuing the conversation. Thank you for creating a space to make meaning out of that horrible event, and for being so incredibly vulnerable. You know my heart is always with you and your family and the community you are helping to shape.
Part V Due to length, the comment is printed in reverse order. This is the last segment.
From my perspective, New York Times Co. v. Sullivan, 376 U.S. 254 (1964) applies to your statements, “They schemed to increase their power. They expressed racist, anti-Black views and plotted to diminish Black political influence. . . . “The conspiracy to diminish Black political power.” Under the New York Times case one can be liable for defamation of character for maliciously and publicly making false statements of fact about public figures causing them harm. From my perspective KNOCK LA, The LA Times and you are fortunate to not yet have been sued for defamation.
There is one person and only one person whom Nury made a suggestion to influence redistricting – that person was Danny Bakewell https://bit.ly/3tfMDTB. Nury related that she had suggested to Bakewell helping two Black councilmembers, Price and Harris-Dawson, stop their in-fighting over assets during redistricting, by allowing CM Price to retain his assets near the Coliseum and for Harris-Dawson to take LAX, which was in your district. None of the Mexican councilmembers even hinted at doing anything to harm Black representation. They also supported MRT (his fate was unknown) and if things went badly with him, they supported Black Heather Hutt for his replacement. As for councilmember Nithya Raman, she was the making of her own re-districting misfortune and these three had nothing to do with Raman’s not getting Koreatown. Black politicos wanted Koreatown, and other councilmembers also disliked Raman. Thus, they deprived her of a renter base and stuck her with mostly homeowners on either side of the Los Feliz-Hollywood Hills “mountains.” It is not racist for one to opinion that Raman is a multi-millionaire carpetbagger whose agenda will destroy some of Los Angeles best residential neighborhoods. However, Nury, Gil and Kevin did not expressed that opinion – that’s my personal judgment of Raman.
The aftermath of KNOCK LA’s, the LA Times’, and your falsely maligning Nury was not only the attack on City Hall and the closing down of council sessions based on the lies, but all the demonstrations at Nury’s home and death threats against her and her son. That is why Nury resigned – not because she did anything wrong, but to protect her son. In one of Los Angeles most despicable times, no official had the integrity to stand up for the Truth, but rather they allowed the falsehoods to grow to the extent that they become political violence. It recapitulated the LA Times anti-Mexican agitation during the “Zoot Suit Riots.”
Anyone may have an opinion about others, but when the opinion is based on intentional misstatement of material facts, they should remember what Shakespeare said about Falstaff, : ‘the better part of valor is discretion.’ Henry IV Part 1, Act V Scene 4.
Another thing which your readers do not know is that Nury knows your son quite well and he sometimes plays with her daughter. Your description of your son is not much different from how Nury describes him. As all members of the city council know, Nury’s mode de ser in public and in private are quite different; perhaps due to a strict Mexican upbringing she circumspect in public but in private, that’s a different thing. She swears worse than a drunken sailor and tells captivating stories with hyperbole – that’s exaggeration for effect. Her story did not have a hint of anti-Black racism. What is racism is your imputing thoughts, feelings and attitudes onto Nury when you should know that everything you say about her totally false.
If you did not know Nury, Gil and Kevin so well, your unwarranted projecting onto them attitudes from studies from how some Anglos see Blacks would not be so out of line. Nury is an individual human being. After all these years of knowing her both on and off the council, you projected onto her completely false feelings and attitudes. Again, when compared to reality, I question whether it is malicious or delusional.
As to her being anti-Gay. Bullshit! I’ve been Gay for over 78 years and nothing she said was anti-Gay. We often question the way some Gays adoptive parents opt for children of different racial backgrounds. It often appears that they use their adopted children to make a social statement. While most Gays do not mention it in public, it is legitimate sentiment. Thus, I can see how Blacks could feel the same way. There are others at city hall who have transracial adopted children, but they do not parade them around like tokens. You may only be doing what you would do with you child of any race or gender when you take your son to city hall, but your manner of behavior has raised questions. People have a right to comment on your behavior, and they have a right to misjudge you in private. If you think that you or your son were being demeaned, then the person who should anger you are the people who released the tape to Reddit and then on KNOCK LA. If the tape had not been made violating criminal statutes, no one would have heard these words which you find so offensive. If you think they are so horrible, why didn’t the releasers delete those sections? That’s a question you never ask while wallowing in self-pity and faux outrage.
Nury did criticize your child rearing practices. Standing alone, one would not be able to decide from her narrative whether or not you fall on the unduly laissez-faire side. The Spare the Rod and Spoil the Child controversy dates back to Proverbs 13:24. It was not invented to harm you. After reading your comments here and elsewhere and from what others say in private, Nury’s opinion is legit.
I spent years as a substitute school teacher and I was a also probation officer in Juvy as well as publishing on Cultural Clash between Anglo and Mexican-American culture. Both Anglos and Mexicans have their factions which are on the one hand too unduly lax and those on the other hand who are too strict. Many Mexican families allow their sons to run all day in las pinches calles with no discipline; others are extremely strict and go to great lengths to make certain their children remain on the ultra straight and extremely narrow path of good behavior. In fact, even los vatos in the gangs impose strict cultural norms. Thus, Mexican families can be especially sensitive to children who are not properly reared. I was raised that it is a disgrace to misbehave in public.
In my experience, the Anglo divide between lax and strict is generally not as severe. That may be due to the fact that more Mexican families are still fighting to make it in an Anglo society. Thus, erring on the side of laxity can ruin a child's chances. Thus, from your Anglo upbringing perspective allowing a child to explore, be rambunctious, and not always mind his p’s and q's may be no big deal.
Another thing that readers do not know is that many in the Black community believe, rightly or wrongly, that you do treat Jacob like some trophy. This idea did not originate with these three; they are merely talking about what they’ve heard other members of the Black community opine. Of course, the three heard what many members of the Black community say and they know what they saw. Her chief of staff was Justin Wesson, the son of Black city council president Herb Wesson. Herb Wesson did not help Nury replace him because she is anti-Black and she did not hire his son because she is anti-Black. People may express opinions about Black children without being racist.
Another thing which your readers do not know is that the first person to release the tape on Reddit did it to harm Justin Wesson, who is Black. The original releaser said nothing about the councilmembers being anti-Black. Whoever did the Reddit release thought that the Black and Mexican councilmembers were too close to organized labor, and the first releaser’s declared goal was to have Rick Caruso force Nury off the city council so that Justin Wesson would have no job! (How that would come about is a mystery, but that’s what the blurb with the Reddit posting said.)
I have digressed from Parece Changuito:
In Mexican culture, there is nothing derogatory about comparing the behavior of children as parece changuito, "acting like a little monkey." The vile interpretation which you and others have imposed upon a non-racist term is worse than unwarranted; again it is either malicious or delusional. The most apt term for your son’s behavior was parece changuito – if one is Mexican.
You appear to have a serious problem. Since I am not a licensed psychologist, I will not attempt pop psychoanalysis, but your interpretation of the contents of the tape is so far off the mark that it strikes me as either malicious or delusional. Nury never said anything negative about any Black person. As for your son, she first referred to him as “este niño.” Later, when she described his behavior on the float, she used a term which Mexicans use for their own children when they are hyper active, "parece changuito." There is world of difference between referring to a child himself as a monkey and describing his behavior as like a monkey.
Here is what Nury said verbatim:
... and then there's this white guy with this little Black kid who's misbehaved. Este niño has no, he's.
Kevin De Leon [00:34:49] Boundaries.
Nury Martinez [00:34:49] Yeah there are no. The kid is bouncing off the f-ing walls on the float, practically tipping it over. There's nothing you can do to control him. Parece changuito. And I'm just like, Oh, my God. I'm over here trying to parent this kid. I'm like you can't do that. I said no! And Mike is like, you know I'm like.
The fact which readers do not know, but which city councilmember Nury Martinez knew, is that you are lax in your child rearing practices. That is why when Nury starts the sentence, Kevin finishes it with “boundaries.” Thus, Nury actually say, “Este niño has no boundaries.” At his age, that is a criticism of the parent, not of the child.
I'm really sorry this happened to you, but it is also extremely naïve to think that people don't have separatist thoughts about anyone who is not like themselves, and it's not just about sexuality or race or other protected classes, but also about politics. People say nasty things about each other and it's great that you call it out but also kind of unrealistic to think that it will change. Humans are hardwired to look for differences, things that are different than themselves, and I believe that that is something about Darwinism. Just some thoughts.
Mike,
Thank you so much for writing this. Thank you for continuing the conversation. Thank you for creating a space to make meaning out of that horrible event, and for being so incredibly vulnerable. You know my heart is always with you and your family and the community you are helping to shape.
Part V Due to length, the comment is printed in reverse order. This is the last segment.
From my perspective, New York Times Co. v. Sullivan, 376 U.S. 254 (1964) applies to your statements, “They schemed to increase their power. They expressed racist, anti-Black views and plotted to diminish Black political influence. . . . “The conspiracy to diminish Black political power.” Under the New York Times case one can be liable for defamation of character for maliciously and publicly making false statements of fact about public figures causing them harm. From my perspective KNOCK LA, The LA Times and you are fortunate to not yet have been sued for defamation.
There is one person and only one person whom Nury made a suggestion to influence redistricting – that person was Danny Bakewell https://bit.ly/3tfMDTB. Nury related that she had suggested to Bakewell helping two Black councilmembers, Price and Harris-Dawson, stop their in-fighting over assets during redistricting, by allowing CM Price to retain his assets near the Coliseum and for Harris-Dawson to take LAX, which was in your district. None of the Mexican councilmembers even hinted at doing anything to harm Black representation. They also supported MRT (his fate was unknown) and if things went badly with him, they supported Black Heather Hutt for his replacement. As for councilmember Nithya Raman, she was the making of her own re-districting misfortune and these three had nothing to do with Raman’s not getting Koreatown. Black politicos wanted Koreatown, and other councilmembers also disliked Raman. Thus, they deprived her of a renter base and stuck her with mostly homeowners on either side of the Los Feliz-Hollywood Hills “mountains.” It is not racist for one to opinion that Raman is a multi-millionaire carpetbagger whose agenda will destroy some of Los Angeles best residential neighborhoods. However, Nury, Gil and Kevin did not expressed that opinion – that’s my personal judgment of Raman.
The aftermath of KNOCK LA’s, the LA Times’, and your falsely maligning Nury was not only the attack on City Hall and the closing down of council sessions based on the lies, but all the demonstrations at Nury’s home and death threats against her and her son. That is why Nury resigned – not because she did anything wrong, but to protect her son. In one of Los Angeles most despicable times, no official had the integrity to stand up for the Truth, but rather they allowed the falsehoods to grow to the extent that they become political violence. It recapitulated the LA Times anti-Mexican agitation during the “Zoot Suit Riots.”
Anyone may have an opinion about others, but when the opinion is based on intentional misstatement of material facts, they should remember what Shakespeare said about Falstaff, : ‘the better part of valor is discretion.’ Henry IV Part 1, Act V Scene 4.
Part IV
Another thing which your readers do not know is that Nury knows your son quite well and he sometimes plays with her daughter. Your description of your son is not much different from how Nury describes him. As all members of the city council know, Nury’s mode de ser in public and in private are quite different; perhaps due to a strict Mexican upbringing she circumspect in public but in private, that’s a different thing. She swears worse than a drunken sailor and tells captivating stories with hyperbole – that’s exaggeration for effect. Her story did not have a hint of anti-Black racism. What is racism is your imputing thoughts, feelings and attitudes onto Nury when you should know that everything you say about her totally false.
If you did not know Nury, Gil and Kevin so well, your unwarranted projecting onto them attitudes from studies from how some Anglos see Blacks would not be so out of line. Nury is an individual human being. After all these years of knowing her both on and off the council, you projected onto her completely false feelings and attitudes. Again, when compared to reality, I question whether it is malicious or delusional.
As to her being anti-Gay. Bullshit! I’ve been Gay for over 78 years and nothing she said was anti-Gay. We often question the way some Gays adoptive parents opt for children of different racial backgrounds. It often appears that they use their adopted children to make a social statement. While most Gays do not mention it in public, it is legitimate sentiment. Thus, I can see how Blacks could feel the same way. There are others at city hall who have transracial adopted children, but they do not parade them around like tokens. You may only be doing what you would do with you child of any race or gender when you take your son to city hall, but your manner of behavior has raised questions. People have a right to comment on your behavior, and they have a right to misjudge you in private. If you think that you or your son were being demeaned, then the person who should anger you are the people who released the tape to Reddit and then on KNOCK LA. If the tape had not been made violating criminal statutes, no one would have heard these words which you find so offensive. If you think they are so horrible, why didn’t the releasers delete those sections? That’s a question you never ask while wallowing in self-pity and faux outrage.
Part III comment is in reverse order,
Part III
Nury did criticize your child rearing practices. Standing alone, one would not be able to decide from her narrative whether or not you fall on the unduly laissez-faire side. The Spare the Rod and Spoil the Child controversy dates back to Proverbs 13:24. It was not invented to harm you. After reading your comments here and elsewhere and from what others say in private, Nury’s opinion is legit.
I spent years as a substitute school teacher and I was a also probation officer in Juvy as well as publishing on Cultural Clash between Anglo and Mexican-American culture. Both Anglos and Mexicans have their factions which are on the one hand too unduly lax and those on the other hand who are too strict. Many Mexican families allow their sons to run all day in las pinches calles with no discipline; others are extremely strict and go to great lengths to make certain their children remain on the ultra straight and extremely narrow path of good behavior. In fact, even los vatos in the gangs impose strict cultural norms. Thus, Mexican families can be especially sensitive to children who are not properly reared. I was raised that it is a disgrace to misbehave in public.
In my experience, the Anglo divide between lax and strict is generally not as severe. That may be due to the fact that more Mexican families are still fighting to make it in an Anglo society. Thus, erring on the side of laxity can ruin a child's chances. Thus, from your Anglo upbringing perspective allowing a child to explore, be rambunctious, and not always mind his p’s and q's may be no big deal.
Part II Comment comes in reverse order
Part II
Another thing that readers do not know is that many in the Black community believe, rightly or wrongly, that you do treat Jacob like some trophy. This idea did not originate with these three; they are merely talking about what they’ve heard other members of the Black community opine. Of course, the three heard what many members of the Black community say and they know what they saw. Her chief of staff was Justin Wesson, the son of Black city council president Herb Wesson. Herb Wesson did not help Nury replace him because she is anti-Black and she did not hire his son because she is anti-Black. People may express opinions about Black children without being racist.
Another thing which your readers do not know is that the first person to release the tape on Reddit did it to harm Justin Wesson, who is Black. The original releaser said nothing about the councilmembers being anti-Black. Whoever did the Reddit release thought that the Black and Mexican councilmembers were too close to organized labor, and the first releaser’s declared goal was to have Rick Caruso force Nury off the city council so that Justin Wesson would have no job! (How that would come about is a mystery, but that’s what the blurb with the Reddit posting said.)
I have digressed from Parece Changuito:
In Mexican culture, there is nothing derogatory about comparing the behavior of children as parece changuito, "acting like a little monkey." The vile interpretation which you and others have imposed upon a non-racist term is worse than unwarranted; again it is either malicious or delusional. The most apt term for your son’s behavior was parece changuito – if one is Mexican.
Part I
You appear to have a serious problem. Since I am not a licensed psychologist, I will not attempt pop psychoanalysis, but your interpretation of the contents of the tape is so far off the mark that it strikes me as either malicious or delusional. Nury never said anything negative about any Black person. As for your son, she first referred to him as “este niño.” Later, when she described his behavior on the float, she used a term which Mexicans use for their own children when they are hyper active, "parece changuito." There is world of difference between referring to a child himself as a monkey and describing his behavior as like a monkey.
Here is what Nury said verbatim:
... and then there's this white guy with this little Black kid who's misbehaved. Este niño has no, he's.
Kevin De Leon [00:34:49] Boundaries.
Nury Martinez [00:34:49] Yeah there are no. The kid is bouncing off the f-ing walls on the float, practically tipping it over. There's nothing you can do to control him. Parece changuito. And I'm just like, Oh, my God. I'm over here trying to parent this kid. I'm like you can't do that. I said no! And Mike is like, you know I'm like.
The fact which readers do not know, but which city councilmember Nury Martinez knew, is that you are lax in your child rearing practices. That is why when Nury starts the sentence, Kevin finishes it with “boundaries.” Thus, Nury actually say, “Este niño has no boundaries.” At his age, that is a criticism of the parent, not of the child.
I'm really sorry this happened to you, but it is also extremely naïve to think that people don't have separatist thoughts about anyone who is not like themselves, and it's not just about sexuality or race or other protected classes, but also about politics. People say nasty things about each other and it's great that you call it out but also kind of unrealistic to think that it will change. Humans are hardwired to look for differences, things that are different than themselves, and I believe that that is something about Darwinism. Just some thoughts.